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A Quiverfull of Kids November 13, 2006

Posted by Michael in Ducks, Religion.
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You have acquired a “quiverfull” of children if you accept as many as God thinks you should have, without any   form of family planning.  Nope, not even the natural methods condoned by the Catholic Church.

The term comes from Psalm 127:

Behold, children are a heritage from the Lord,
The fruit of the womb is a reward.
Like arrows in the hand of a warrior,
So are the children of one’s youth.
Happy is the man who has his quiver full of them.

In the case of the Bortel family, a quiverfull is 11 kids, so far.

Bortel Family

Updated: 1:39 p.m. ET Nov 13, 2006

Nov. 13, 2006 – It’s hardly a typical scene from the suburbs. The Bortel home outside San Antonio, Tex., counts 12 members—parents David and Suzanne and their 10 children, ranging from 13 months to 15 (the 20-year-old married and moved away)—all crammed into a four-bedroom house that trembles constantly with activity. Everything revolves around the home: Dad works there, the kids are schooled there, the youngest three were born there. The family uses a 15-passenger van to get around, and at night, the kids climb into multiple sets of bunk beds. David and Suzanne hear the same questions repeatedly. So for the record: No, they’re not Catholic. Yes, they’ve heard of birth control. And no, they’re not crazy. In fact, they’d happily welcome a twelfth child. “It’s about obedience to God,” says David, 38. “The Bible says that God is the only opener and closer of the womb.”

The Bortels form part of the “quiverfull” movement, a small but growing conservative Protestant group that eschews all forms of birth control and believes that family planning is exclusively God’s domain.

You can’t help but be impressed with David and Suzanne.  Eleven kids, and he is only 38.  Those two have been obviously been diligent about  filling the quiver.  That must take some dedication with all those kids crammed into a four-bedroom house.  How do they have the energy?

I’m also wondering about the quiverfull of tuition bills these folks are looking at when the kids get old enough for college.

Newsweek – How full is your quiver?

Comments»

1. a-a - November 13, 2006

What a couple of dumbasses.

2. kevlarchick - November 13, 2006

I hate to be cynical in the face of so much fruitfulness, but I wonder if they’re on public assistance?

3. skinbad - November 13, 2006

It used to be more common in Mormon neighborhoods to see families with 7-10 (and even more) kids. It still happens though. I’ve seen it where the mom and dad pull it off and the kids are obviously accomplished, educated, and well-cared for. Unfortutately, I’m familiar with several who were good at making the babies, but that was about it.

4. sandy burger - November 13, 2006

I’m all in favor of big happy families, but I’m a little uncomfortable with their logic for some reason. I don’t know why, but something about this reminds me of “Christian Scientists”. (No offense intended to any Christian Scientists who may be reading this, but that’s just not what I believe.)

5. sandy burger - November 13, 2006

One of my grandparents came from a family a little bigger than this one. They lived on a farm, though, not in a city.

6. BrewFan - November 13, 2006

Is it just me or does it look like the oldest are getting all of the food?

7. Retired Geezer - November 13, 2006

lol Brewfan

8. Michael - November 13, 2006

Fine with me if they want to have a lot of kids. But what bothers me is that they seem to interpret a Psalm as a legal mandate. I’m thinking they are better at making babies than understanding scripture.

9. Dave in Texas - November 13, 2006

Last time I checked Galatians, we were sorta off the hook on that whole “law” thing.

Did I misread that? What does Tobit have to say about this?

Should I get my v reversed?

Actually, there’s no way I’d even consider that, given my last experience. I am not fruitful, I will not multiply, but I ain’t dead either ifyouknowwhatImeanandIthinkyoudo.

10. a-a - November 13, 2006

INDC Bill is going to Iraq. Hopefully for good:

http://hotair.com/archives/2006/11/13/indc-in-iraq/

11. BrewFan - November 13, 2006

There goes the war. Once the world’s biggest asshole hits the ground the whole country is going to join the insurgency.

12. Rightwingsparkle - November 13, 2006

You know, I have always used natural family planning. (I take my Catholism very seriously) and I honestly believe that children are our greatest blessings. I took what God gave me, which was four. But the families I know that have much more, like my daughter’s boyfriend who has 10 brothers and sisters, they really are amazing. The thing that I see over and over is the children from large families tend to not rebel like those from smaller ones. At least that has been my experience.

My husband’s family had 6 children and she started late (Mom was 30 when she married) and the difference I saw from my own family of 3 children, was the sense of independence and they were obviously not spoiled. My husband put himself through college. I just haven’t ever seen a downside to big families from responsible parents.

13. Rightwingsparkle - November 13, 2006

Also, let me add one more thing…I never seen a family regret having more childen. I have even considered adoption.

I mean look at Michael and Dave. From what I have seen, it probably doesn’t get any better as far as Dads go. Why shouldn’t you raise more kids to be more like you guys??? God knows we need more men like you guys in this world.

14. BrewFan - November 13, 2006

The thing that I see over and over is the children from large families tend to not rebel like those from smaller ones

Well sure. They’re emaciated from lack of food. Just look at the picture.

15. geoff - November 13, 2006

Muslihoon had a related post.

16. geoff - November 13, 2006

I quiver at their quiver.

17. Dave in Texas - November 13, 2006

The world need more knuckleheads like me. I know it.

So I try to influence the younger dads I work with.

You’ll be pleased to know they don’t mind farting out loud now.

18. Sobek - November 13, 2006

“…filling the quiver.”

That’s one heckuva euphemism.

19. Elzbth - November 13, 2006

Burying the duck, filling the equiver, this site has a plethora of euphamisms…I’m still laughing over Brewfan #6.

20. Dave in Texas - November 14, 2006

Is it just me or does it look like the oldest are getting all of the food?

I’d do a recount. I think they ate one of em.

21. lauraw - November 14, 2006

I think that’s kind of admirable. As long as they’re not on the dole, of course.

Many people can afford large families, but yeah its a pain in the ass. If these folks view children as a blessing, who are we to crap on them?

The article made reference to younger children in large families suffering from a lack of resources. Poppycock. The youngest ones tend to be more coddled as kids, fostering resentment in older siblings. I’ve seen this in several families of eight or more kids.

22. Retired Geezer - November 14, 2006

On the bright side, they only have to buy one set of clothes and just keep handing it down.

OK, that was ridiculous.

23. Retired Geezer - November 14, 2006

I guess I’m just bitter because I had to keep wearing all my sister’s old dresses.

24. harrison - November 14, 2006

Still, RG?

25. Retired Geezer - November 14, 2006

Nah, but I’m really glad she switched to pantsuits in the 70’s.

26. Dave in Texas - November 14, 2006

I joke, but I think it’s fine too, with Laura’s caveat. I have a few friends with large families (5 or more). I’ve noticed that the older kids step up and help out with mothering duties, looking after the little ones, sooner than most kids would in smaller families. I’ve seen the drill on a typical weekday morning and it’s sweet.. a 12 year old changing a diaper or feeding a toddler.

I grew up in a medium big fam… I have 3 younger sisters (who all ADORE me). 10 year spectrum, I did diapers and feeding stuff… bathtime. No big.

27. kevlarchick - November 14, 2006

Mr Kevlar is the youngest of 8. His brothers tormented the snot outta him, his sisters mothered him. He wore his share of makeup and nail polish.

I think most brothers, even though they may fight dirty at home, instinctively look out for their sisters outside of the house. Very protective.

28. daveintexas - November 14, 2006

Tormenting sisters is fun. I made it an art form.

When I was a senior some punk in the locker room was mouthin off about what he wanted to do to my sister. He didn’t know we were related.

Teeth, meet locker.

Do I get thanked? Oh noooooooo…. she is pissed off at me for a month.

29. Feisty - November 14, 2006

No one can say a child will be better off in a family of 12 siblings than they would be in a family of 1 or 2 siblings, all other things being equal. There’s more time to read to the child, more time to help each individual child with homework, enroll them in music or whatever, more money for the child to attend a better school, more money for the family to live in a better neighborhood, etc.

No one’s paying any tuition bills because the family size is so high, any of these kids’ll get to go to college for free, assuming the parents who started having kids at age 18 are able to teach the kids advanced science ‘n stuff.

If one thinks they should have oodles of children just to fill some sort of order of God and not fulfill a duty to the child himself to help him to be a good human being, then screw ’em.

30. composmentis - November 14, 2006

Eleven kids. Do you think Mr. Bortel can even feel the sides anymore, or does he have to miner’s helmet and go spelunking?

31. composmentis - November 14, 2006

put on a miner’s helmet. Yeah. And I’m sober. Which just means I’m stoopud.

32. Debra - December 12, 2006

I’m not here to give an opinion about big families. However, you all who want to make fun of innocent children by ridiculing their weight, idiotic comments about one eating another, and making immature jokes about the elasticity of the wife’s birth canal need to grow up and get a life.

Perhaps we should find things out about you people who make the sorry jokes and post them on a public website to see how it feels.

How about being better Christians and not ridiculing those who think differently than you do. It just shows your own ignorance.

33. BrewFan - December 12, 2006

Perhaps we should find things out about you people who make the sorry jokes and post them on a public website to see how it feels.

You’ve obviously never visited this place.

P.S. If being a better Christian is defined as being more like you I’ll pass.

34. daveintexas - December 12, 2006

I’m not here to give an opinion about big families.

Good, cause I bet that one sucks too.

Perhaps we should find things out about you people who make the sorry jokes and post them on a public website to see how it feels.

Perhaps you should. Google “Dave in Texas”. Lot’s of material.

Incidentally, who’s “we”? Is it some formal group, or are we just talkin about the “voices” here?

not ridiculing those who think differently than you do.

You mean like you?

Sorry, can’t help myself.

I’m baaaaad.

35. Michael - December 12, 2006

making immature jokes about the elasticity of the wife’s birth canal need to grow up and get a life.

This site is all about making immature jokes, precisely because we don’t want to grow up and get a life.

Perhaps we should find things out about you people who make the sorry jokes and post them on a public website to see how it feels.

Erm, I think we’ve got that covered, Deb. We know each other pretty well, and the sorry jokes are pretty much a constant around here.

Did you know Dave dropped a propane tank on his foot? Fuckin’ Texas goober klutz. His Christian theology is also riddled with synergistic heresies. I’m not sayin’ he’s necessarily going to hell, but he’s on notice.

How about being better Christians and not ridiculing those who think differently than you do. It just shows your own ignorance.

Totally agree with you about our ignorance.

How about you being a better Christian and not sounding like such a tight-ass?

36. BrewFan - December 12, 2006

I’m not sayin’ he’s necessarily going to hell, but he’s on notice.

Ok, that made me giggle like a retard…oops, sorry Deb.

37. Michael - December 12, 2006

Hey Brew, you’re on notice too with that Calvinist “eternal security” shit. I hope I have made that clear.

I’m just trying to be helpful.

I look at it this way — when I get to heaven, we Lutherans are going to need an adequate supply of Baptists, Methodists, Calvinists, Catholics and so forth to wash the windows, cut the grass, tend to the flower gardens, and otherwise do the menial labor. So, feel free to use my name as a character reference on Judgment Day when you are standing before the Throne of Grace, trying to explain your theology. I’m on your side.

38. Retired Geezer - December 12, 2006

Uh, would the Episcopalians be like the “Americas Next Top Model” contestants?
You know with the robes and stuff.

39. daveintexas - December 12, 2006

only one character reference I’ll be needing, thanks just the same.

hell I wouldn’t use a Lutheran character reference to get me outta traffic court in Tijuana.

40. Wickedpinto - December 12, 2006

Damn,

I’m crude, but Deb’s a self-righteous bitch.

41. Wickedpinto - December 12, 2006

the “WE” on this site, I’m still a bit outside, but from what I gather.

Theres 2 lutherins (sp?) 2 Catholics (sp) at least 4 atheists/agnostics(I include myself) 1 supposed mormon, several baptists, but I think there is only 1 SB. 1 converted muslim, and several other denominations.

I might have screwed that up I’m sure, and some of those, actually only one, applies to two of those categories.

This is a rather broad access, and broad RESPECT site, that allows people to speak respectfully. Even _I_ am respectful of center at this place, because this is a place packed with good people with open and passionate thoughts about all aspects of life, not just one tiny little aspect of egoism DEBRA.

Really, get the crucicock out of your ass, and look at what people say, and how they say it.

42. Debra - December 12, 2006

Ok,

Thanks for explaining that this is a forum where you all have fun and joke around.

You got my dander up because although I don’t agree with the Quiverfull idealogy or the obstacles that the children pictured in the Newseek article are facing or will face….

Hell, I know those kids and they are sweethearts and it’s hard to have people making such fun of them.

They truly are blessings and yes, they do live in a “fishbowl”

Some of them can’t help it that the got the “big boy” and “big girl” genes whereas the others got the DNA from the other side of the (skinnier) family tree.

Say something nice about the family along with the jabs. They are real people, and from Texas, you know. Those kids behave better and are sweeter than tons of kids I know from smaller families. It’s not their fault they were born into this movement.

P.S. The “we” that I referred to in my post is the many, many electronically savy, yet bored teenagers that I know who blog for hours on “MySpace” and “Facebook” With them, you don’t have a chance at cyber anononymity. Your shortcomings, as well as the digital photos that will accompany those faults, will be circulating around the internet in no time. We know where you live…(Evil Laugh.)

Dee

43. Michael - December 12, 2006

only one character reference I’ll be needing, thanks just the same.

See, that right there is Lutheran theology.

(Keep my card in your back pocket, just in case)

44. Feisty - December 12, 2006

Don’t count me as Lutheran, WP…

45. Michael - December 12, 2006

Theres 2 lutherins (sp?) 2 Catholics (sp) at least 4 atheists/agnostics(I include myself) 1 supposed mormon, several baptists, but I think there is only 1 SB. 1 converted muslim, and several other denominations.

Don’t forget that we have Jewish readers. I’m not sure how to account for Muslihoon. Just add one to every category and you’ve probably got him covered.

46. daveintexas - December 12, 2006

Say something nice about the family along with the jabs.

fair enough. How’s this?

26. Dave in Texas – November 14, 2006
I joke, but I think it’s fine too, with Laura’s caveat. I have a few friends with large families (5 or more). I’ve noticed that the older kids step up and help out with mothering duties, looking after the little ones, sooner than most kids would in smaller families. I’ve seen the drill on a typical weekday morning and it’s sweet.. a 12 year old changing a diaper or feeding a toddler.

I grew up in a medium big fam… I have 3 younger sisters (who all ADORE me). 10 year spectrum, I did diapers and feeding stuff… bathtime. No big.

47. Michael - December 12, 2006

Ok,
Thanks for explaining that this is a forum where you all have fun and joke around.
Thanks for being a good sport, Deb. It’s kinda merciless around here. This site is not for everyone.

Point well taken about the kids. There’s a bunch of past and present Texans on this site (myself included), so there is a lot of sympathy here for Texas family values.

48. Michael - December 12, 2006

Don’t count me as Lutheran, WP…

Aw, Feisty, c’mon. Deep down, you know you are a Lutheran. I can tell.

49. Retired Geezer - December 13, 2006

Thanks for being a good sport, Deb. It’s kinda merciless around here.

Yeah, I’m barely holding my own and I *live* here.

*lower lip trembles slightly*

50. Wickedpinto - December 13, 2006

You know that trembling lip is Sexy!

Don’t make me give you a kiss Geezer, cuz that is just so damn cute.

We all know that your wife is the one who wears the pants, since she’s the one who takes the combat positions for your little “household” games.

So when your lower lip quivers? it just makes me think “geezers, got himself a perty mouth!”

Remeber the fact that I been to the brigg.

51. It's like Bart is a kid in a candy store; he doesn't know where to begin - December 13, 2006

1. Debra, you had me at “elasticity of wife’s birth canal.”
Hoo-ha, that was good. By the way, up in my neck of the woods, we call it a “huuuuuuge vagina.”

2. It’s nice to see the rest of you guys get scolded once in a while. The best part was that I wasn’t even part of your little juvenile party.
So DON’T EVER try to say ol’ Bart drags IB down. Ever.

Shame on you for making fun of the Bortel family.

Shame. On. All. Of. Yous.

By the way, I’m glad that Sparkle takes her “Catholism” very seriously. I’ve always admired the devout Catholes.

P.S.
Is it just me or does it look like the oldest are getting all of the food?

You know the old saying: He or she who eats fastest eats bestest.

52. geoff - December 13, 2006

Sigh. You try to have a nice blog…

Oh wait. This is IB.

53. sandy burger - December 13, 2006

If I make it to heaven…

A. It’ll be a miracle
B. I’ll pass on the harp, thanks
C. Lightning bolt! Lightning bolt!
D. It’ll serve those nuns right

54. sandy burger - December 13, 2006

“huuuuuuge vagina.”

Please. Comfy quinny.

55. Bart - December 13, 2006

Actually, we say “big ol’ box,” but I thought that would be too crude to say.

56. composmentis - December 13, 2006

Theres 2 lutherins (sp?) 2 Catholics (sp) at least 4 atheists/agnostics(I include myself) 1 supposed mormon, several baptists, but I think there is only 1 SB. 1 converted muslim, and a partridge in a pear tree

I attended Catholic elementary. During one of the classroom discussions on theology, one of the kids piped up and said, “I’m an athiest. Swear to God!” One of the funniest things I’d ever heard. What? I was 12.

*lower lip trembles slightly* You ain’t foolin’ anyone swabbie.

Deb, we don’t pull any punches around here when it comes to tyring to make the funny, but if you check out some other posts, I think you’ll find that this crew is actually a good bunch of nuts. Stick around, maybe we’ll grow on ya, kinda like fur on a peach.

57. Retired Geezer - December 13, 2006

kinda like fur on a peach.

Or, uh, mold on Sour Cream.

That could lead to something helpful like… Penicillin.

58. Debra - December 13, 2006

Hi all you silly bloggers.

What is IB? (Internet Blog?) I’m new at this.

1. Debra, you had me at “elasticity of wife’s birth canal.”
Hoo-ha, that was good. By the way, up in my neck of the woods, we call it a “huuuuuuge vagina.”

Well “Bart?”. Around here we have ads on one of the more polite radio stations that announce boldly, “Do you suffer from vaginal atrophy? If so…..
Maybe all those multi birth mom’s will be poster children for the vaginal atrophy study. Wait, that’s probably the more “withered” old ladies….these must be the vaginal protrusion study ladies.

Reminds me of a slimy octopus without legs emerging from the southern region of the good ole gals’ reproductive cavity. How do you get a support garment for that?

Anyway, you guys can make fun of us women, but when I hear my first radio ad for a study on penile proportion inadequacy, I’ll think of ya all. I imagine many of you have issues and concerns….Just kidding. (And no blogs about how fine and mighty you think you are in the male endowment category. Women would much rather you be gentlemen than an over-blown (no pun intended) advocate for Big Joey and the boys.
Dee

Dee

59. sandy burger - December 13, 2006

Believe me, Debra, if there were a penile proportion inadequacy solution which actually worked, I’d be all over it. Your old pal Sandy is many things, but I am no Dick Cheney.

60. Retired Geezer - December 13, 2006

What is IB? (Internet Blog?)

That would be us, the Innocent Bystanders of Michaels non-blog.

Uh, Bart participated (not voluntarily, I might add), in that penile proportion study.
Blame him.

61. Debra - December 13, 2006

Oh yeah, I did hear about Bart being part of that study.
So sorry to hear about there being irreversible psychological damage. I agree that the charts and graphs should include the proportions of more males of a physically smaller genetic group. Isn’t there any compassion for the “little guy?”

Dee

62. Retired Geezer - December 13, 2006

Oh yeah, I did hear about Bart being part of that study.

See Dee, you’re gonna fit in here after all.

63. sandy burger - December 13, 2006

Isn’t there any compassion for the “little guy?”

I like her already.

64. Michael - December 13, 2006

By the way, I’m glad that Sparkle takes her “Catholism” very seriously. I’ve always admired the devout Catholes.

I was hoping someone else would say this. I really don’t want to.

But . . .

That was frickin’ hilarious, Bart.

65. A Quiverfull of Kids | News - August 26, 2018

[…] A Quiverfull of Kids […]


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