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Ballistic Blogging: I Need Some Direction February 24, 2010

Posted by wintersetruss in Ballistics, Entertainment, History, Man Laws, Nature Shit, Personal Experiences, Technology.
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  I’ve wanted to get a regular feature going where I take a firearm out & run it through its paces, and I thought I might poll the audience to see where everyone wants me to start.  Here are the options:

1.  An old (1928) Russian Mosin Nagant 91/30 rifle.  I recently acquired one that I’m in the process of fitting a long eye relief scope AND a trigger kit onto.  This is the same rifle mi amigo eddiebear has, but with a few extra “flourishes”.

2.  An Austrian Steyr Model 95 straight pull carbine from the late teens/1920’s era.  It’s a punisher for recoil, but with scaled-back cast bullet reloads it should be a good woods gun.  I recently read an article in Shotgun News where a gunsmith mounted a pivoting scope on one of these old beasts, and I think I’ve got the itch to try it myself.

3.  My fave – the Rossi copy of an 1892 Winchester lever action in .357 magnum.  This gun just FEELS right, and even though it’s nowhere near as powerful as the others mentioned, it’s fun to shoot.

4.  One of my pistols.  I’ve never really done any intensive target shooting with a pistol, and it might be fun to do so and report back with the results.

5.  Shotgun.  Not much marksmanship required, but sometimes its fun to make things go SPLAT.  Especially large fruits.

6.  Any one of my .22 rifles.  Twenty-two rifles are the gateway drug for firearms collectors, and they never get old.  I’ve got more than a few of them sitting in the closet, and taking one out for a playdate is a cheap proposition.  One box of .22 ammo costs about the same as TWO rounds from my Austrian 95, so what these guns lack in BOOM factor, you can somewhat make up for in volume.

7.  “Other”.  No, I don’t have a plasma rifle in the 40mW range, but I do possess other weapons (ALL of which are legal in the Soverign State of Iowa), and I’m open to suggestions.  I’m probably NOT going to go out and buy something just to have it for a post, but if you INSIST, I would be willing to accept a gratuity and then keep the resulting purchase for a “long term” (40+ years?) evaluation.

  Back in the mid-oughts, I used to be a big fan of Gullyborg (a buddy of SondraK from the Pacific NW) and his “carnival of cordite”.  Maybe a semi-regular hoplophilic feature here at IB would be a fun thing to do.  Plus, it would help if we could become better marksmen as a group.  That way, next time the Hostages come riding into town trying to steal our chickens & terrorize the wimmenfolks, we can meet them with an appropriate reception.

Comments»

1. Cathy - February 24, 2010

Austrian Steyr Model 95 straight pull carbine

My Vote. Don’t know much, but I like the sound of it.

2. Cathy - February 24, 2010

^… like the sound of “punisher for recoil”

3. The Lovely Janis - February 24, 2010

Choice Number #7 — Remember Russ there is a moratorium on gun purchases!!! There is no more room in your gun closet and all proceeds go to the send Moses to College Fund.

4. The Lovely Janis - February 24, 2010

And I think you should go out with the shot gun I bought you that you have hardly used.

5. Russ from Winterset - February 24, 2010

Hardly used? Pound for pound, it’s the grand champion of my gun closet. I’ve taken three deer with that gun.

6. Tushar - February 24, 2010

>>That way, next time the Hostages come riding into town trying to steal our chickens & terrorize the wimmenfolks, we can meet them with an appropriate reception.

The Hostages don’t come riding into town. They sneak up on you, throw a few insults your way, and disappear before you can get a bearing on them. Oh and about those chickens, stealing is not what is on a typical Hostage’s mind.

7. skinbad - February 24, 2010

shotgun + fruits + video

8. Dave in Texas - February 24, 2010

>> ^… like the sound of “punisher for recoil”

yeah, my high school nickname.

9. Retired Geezer - February 24, 2010

The .357 Rossi. For old time’s sake
We used to have them.

10. blackcoffee - February 24, 2010

^^”punisher for recoil”

Man, I feel like a fat kid in a candy store.

I thought I would like this blog the first time Ace linked me over this-away. Now, I think I’m in love.

11. Russ from Winterset - February 24, 2010

Hey Mr. Administrator Man: Could I get a “Ballistics” category added?

12. BrewFan - February 24, 2010

Ask and you shall receive – WordPress 3:16

Sincerely,
BrewFan, Assistant to the Site Administrator

13. Vmaximus - February 24, 2010

I like the Rossi too!

But if the Hostages and IB go shooting it would look like this
H2 http://tinyurl.com/yllxfd6 (Skip the first min)
IB http://tinyurl.com/yzyc3wa

14. Michael - February 24, 2010

Vmax, who among us is willing to deny that they have been tagged by a scope with that distinctive semi-circle cut over the eye? If you have never done that, you weren’t trying hard enough

15. Michael - February 24, 2010

Front to Rear — Hostages, IB

16. Michael - February 24, 2010

^
Of course, I don’t try shit like that with Cathy.

She would turn around and shoot me.

17. Vmaximus - February 24, 2010

I admit I was bit by my 300 Weatherby the first time I fired it Michael.

And I was snakebit by my Colt Delta Elite (10 mm) after a few times of firing it.

I lurves teh 10 mm

40 short and wimpy is ok too, but just ok.

18. TXMarko - February 24, 2010

We have to CHOOSE?!?

Why can’t you just do them ALL, one at a time?

Start with the sexy lever-action, though. Please?

Pictures will be required, of course…

19. Michael - February 24, 2010

Russ, are you really going to get into ballistics? That would be cool. It’s a topic that is endlessly debatable, like the merits (for a personal defense weapon) of a fast-and-light 9 mm popgun (which is damn near a .22), or the big-and-slow .45 1911.

I’m a .45 guy.

Bullet Weight – 230 grain (14.9 grams)
Bullet Type – FMJ (normally, newer models work OK with fragmentation rounds)
Ballistic Coefficient – .195
Muzzle Velocity – 830 feet per second
Energy at 25 yards – 350 foot-pounds (which is gonna hurt real bad with a fragmentation round creating multiple wound channels, and no energy wasted on the the exit that would be expected from a FMJ round)
Effective Range – 100 yards
Mid-Range Trajectory – 1.6 @ 50 yards

A good review of the 1911 and the .45 ACP cartridge can be found here.

20. Michael - February 24, 2010

My deer rifle is a .270, but that was not a choice. The thing is ancient; I’ve been told it may be a collector’s item (but the scope is relatively new). I inherited it from my Dad.

Michael - February 24, 2010

I think I also have an old 30-06 around here somewhere, also inherited from Dad. I’m not sure what it’s good for. IIRC, that’s what Son Michael used to kill a wild boar in Florida when Dad took him hunting. I remember deer hunting with that rifle when I was a kid.

21. Michael - February 24, 2010

Here is my adolescent hunting tale:

After a long cold Michigan morning lugging that 30-06, I headed back towards our car. Had not seen a deer at all, and I was miserable. I was just mid-teens at the time. Then, a deer appeared, a doe, but I had a doe permit. I raised the gun and aimed, shaking like a leaf from adrenalin, but I noticed that the doe, although standing still, was right in the line of sight with our car, a Comet station wagon behind her. Thank God, I had the presence of mind not to shoot. Eventually, the doe noticed me and trotted off to where she was away from our car, at which point I let loose a round in her general direction out of sheer frustration, which caused the doe to quicken her pace slightly.

Shortly thereafter, Dad Michael showed up, curious about the explosion. Turns out, he had been tracking that deer in the snow, trying to flush it in my general direction. I explained to him that I had not shot the car. He was OK with that.

True story.

22. Michael - February 25, 2010

The Rev. Prof. Dr. Dad Michael was a cool guy in a lot of ways.

Theologian, pastor, hunter, fisher, organic gardener (decades before this was cool), camper, psychologist, builder (he built his own first parsonage). He came of age in a dirt-poor fatherless family — his mother was a widow — during the Great Depression, and never thought twice about being disadvantaged. He just focused on how to better himself.

Husband and father, above all.

23. Gromulin - February 25, 2010

I vote for the Steyr. I’m a C&R guy, and am looking at getting some kind of straight pull this year…either a Steyr or a K-31. Would love to hear more.

I’ve just started shooting the Mossberg M-44US I bought from the CMP for $175 last year. Man, what a great .22. Wish I would have got a couple more for the kids.

24. Michael - February 25, 2010

My Dad’s idea about eating really really good sweet corn was that it all depends on the conversion of starch to sugar when you boil it. But, according to Dad, the starch content of corn starts to dissipate as soon as you harvest the corn. So, the system is:

1. Plant some sweet corn uphill from the kitchen, but not too far away, so you can run back fast.

2. When the corn is ready to harvest, boil a pot of water.

3. After the water is boiling, go pluck a few ears of corn, shucking them as you run downhill.

4. Boil corn.

5. Eat.

He actually did this when we lived in Ann Arbor with a garden that was slightly uphill from the kitchen.

He also grew the best tomatoes that have ever appeared on this planet. We also gorged on strawberries in late spring and cantaloupes later in the summer.

25. Michael - February 25, 2010

When I was in college, I had a friend, Ed, who was a huge fan of tomatoes. I told him about my Dad’s tomatoes, and suggested he should try some. Ed took me literally. He went to Dad’s tomato garden with a salt shaker, and stood there eating tomatoes. Dad noticed the guy, but left him alone. Later on, he asked me about this. I assured him that Ed was only slightly crazy, and I had invited him to try those tomatoes. Ed thought they were great, by the way. Best tomatoes ever.

True story.

Ed was more than slightly crazy. He suffered from depression. He later shot himself in a suicide attempt, and then called me when he realized he had failed. I think I’ve told that story before.

26. Michael - February 25, 2010

Ed, by the way, is indirectly the reason why my son is not named Martin, after Martin Luther, which was my first choice.

See, after Ed shot himself, he did some time in the locked psychiatric ward of the VA hospital in Ann Arbor. I used to visit him. I could get in there any time because my Mom, a veteran Army nurse from WWII, had been a psychiatric nurse on that ward. “Visiting hours” restrictions did not apply to me because I was Sandy’s kid, which was a good thing given my schedule with classes and a job. Sometimes Cathy, who I was dating at the time, went with me.

Ed’s best pal on that ward (and even after he was released) was a guy named Martin. He was a schizo. We got to know him pretty well, and he was actually a very nice guy. Unfortunately, Cathy’s first encounter with Martin was when he was really out of it, shambling down a hall with his pants around his ankles and talking to the voices in his head.

So, the name “Martin” just did not have a good vibe for her, thanks to Ed’s pal Martin. She nixed it.

27. Michael - February 25, 2010

Speaking of ballistics, Ed shot himself mid-torso with a .22 long rifle shell. He was using a rifle. How dumb is that? The bullet hit no bone but did not even exit. It stopped just under his skin next to his spine. after nicking his duodenum. That shot was an annoyance. He sounded pretty composed when he called me to request some help.

You can’t expect a .22 to get the job done. From what I’ve read, you can’t expect much shock from a 9mm either.

28. Vmaximus - February 25, 2010

Michael’s Musings, are cool.

But I am growing some good ‘maters.

29. Russ from Winterset - February 25, 2010

Gromulin, if you’re in the market for a straight pull, get the K31. No question. It’s a damn fine rifle. If you’d bought one 5 years ago, you could have gotten it for $220 like I did, but now you’re gonna pay around $375 for one without a cracked stock (get the walnut stock instead of the beech one, it looks cooler). Plus, you’ll miss out on getting the Swiss surplus ammo for it at $20 for a brick of 60 (the best price I’ve seen lately is about $30 a brick, and mostly it sells for around $32-$38 a brick). Seriously, I would recommend the K31 over damn near every other C&R rifle out there, and it even edges out the Garand (mainly on a cost basis).

So you’re a Mossberg rifle fan? I think we’re gonna get along just fine. I’ve got a whole closet full of 30’s/40’s/50’s Mossberg .22 rifles. I especially like the 46M and the 142A, but my 44US is a good shooter as well.

30. GrumpyUnk - February 25, 2010

Russ- Write up all of them. I’m interested in the scope for the Mosin & how that goes. I’ve got Mojo sights on one and they’re a great improvement. Details please on brands of scope, mount, etc.

31. GrumpyUnk - February 25, 2010

Michael- We joke in the ER about only “Underachievers” using a .22 for a suicide attempt.
Although I’ve seen guys fail with 9mm, .40, .45 and Shotguns.

I’ll tell ya about one of the coolest weapon choices after the court case is squared up. Yes, we saved him and now he’s suing every swinging dick that even saw the AmberLance drive by.
I’ll give him props for trying. It wasn’t some half hearted attempt. Just wasn’t his day to day.

32. Russ from Winterset - February 25, 2010

Unk, I damn near bought a set of the Mojo sights for my MN carbine, and I’m still considering getting them for my K31. Everyone seems to rave about them, and I’ve never read a bad review.

33. Russ from Winterset - February 25, 2010

LMAO at “wickedmichael” dropping some stream of consciousness posts on my ballistics thread.

34. doc - February 25, 2010

cool posts, Michael. When did your father pass away? Both my parents are still around (in FLA for the winter atm). When I think about it, I realize I am not really prepared for either of them to leave us.

35. Michael - February 25, 2010

About 15 years ago, Doc.

36. Pupster - February 25, 2010

My great uncle was successful in his suicide with a .22 revolver.

If you came to the inaugural IB Superbowl Party you may have fired off a few rounds with the same pistol.

37. Dave in Texas - February 25, 2010

>> My great uncle was successful in his suicide with a .22 revolver.

Are we related? My grandfather did same with a .22 revolver.

38. lauraw - February 25, 2010

Oh that’s awful.

39. Pupster - February 25, 2010

COUSIN DAVE?

40. Eddie The Bear - February 25, 2010

I love My Mosin and My Taurus Judge.

41. Pupster - February 25, 2010

It’s not a happy story, no.

He was the first ‘cool’ relative I remember, lived in the mountains, had a pretty extensive collection of manly things like guns, knives, guitars. He owned horses and his property was criss-crossed with lots of trails. I shot my first gun, caught and cleaned my first fish, and rode my first horse on his mountain.

He also drank about a case of beer a day, everyday. Doctor finally told him quit drinking or else. He chose ‘else’.

42. Eddie The Bear - February 25, 2010

http://doubleplusundead.mee.nu/hes_coming_right_for_us

Veeshir discusses the merits of the S&W 500 Speedloader

43. Dave in Texas - February 25, 2010

>> COUSIN DAVE?

Pups, PUPS. IZ DAT YOU?

My mom’s dad, the only grandparent I knew, mom’s mom passed away when I was one, and dad’s parents both died when he was a kid. Pappy had a drinking problem too, but all my memories of him are really good ones, he was a sweet guy. I was 6 when he died.

44. lauraw - February 25, 2010

I’m not so sentimental about objects but knowing me I would have sold that particular gun. You tough man, Pups.

45. Michael - February 25, 2010

I love my Taurus .38.

46. Gromulin - February 25, 2010

Russ, Yeah, I know…I’ve been lusting after K-31’s for years. I decided to focus on the CMP Garands and Carbines for the last few years, and glad I did. I’m getting geared up for metallic reloading, so I figured it’s now safe to start looking at some bolt actions: K-31, M1903 maybe a K98.

But for now…saving lunch money to stock up on the 30-06 due into CMP soon.

The gun collectors lament: If I die, my wife will sell my guns for what I told her I paid for them.

47. Dave in Texas - February 25, 2010

Michael, poophead.

I have no idea what happened to that .22. One of mom’s brothers might have it. There’s one more sad chapter to this, mom’s oldest brother had 2 daughters and two sons. The second girl, my cousin, also killed herself with a handgun (also had problems with alcoholism). She was 42.

48. skinbad - February 25, 2010

One of my best friends was a runner and, on a kick, entered a run and shoot competition–kind of a dry biathlon event. He had completed most of the course and was shooting at one of the stations when witnesses said he appeared to get lightheaded and fell. He still had his finger on the trigger and the butt of the rifle hit the ground and the barrel ended up under his chin at the same time. One .22 LR round did it. They kept his body alive for awhile, but he was brain dead. My son’s middle name was given in his honor.

49. Dave in Texas - February 25, 2010

oh man, that’s awful.

50. skinbad - February 25, 2010

Yes. I tell kids/scouts about my friend whenever I hear “it’s only a .22” talk. In other words, “Sure, let’s go shoot, but if I see you screwing around, you’re done for the day.”

51. Ronald Reagan - February 25, 2010

It was only a .22!

52. skinbad - February 25, 2010

Supposedly, it’s a hit-man caliber of choice. I’ve read that, but I don’t know if it’s true.

53. skinbad - February 25, 2010

Speaking of .22s. My father-in-law killed a bull with one. Yes, it took a while. The bull was injured and he couldn’t get it to a slaughter house and a .22 rifle was all he had in the truck. It’s a hilarious/awful story that I feel guilty about laughing at every time I hear it. He’s a very good story teller.

54. Russ from Winterset - February 25, 2010

It’s S.O.P. for meat lockers that are too small to have the “captive bolt” guns to use a .22 rifle. One shot between the eyes will drop them like 3rd period French class.

And as far as the hit man story goes, I’ve also heard that .22 pistols are popular. After all, if you’re putting one into the back of the skull from close range, you really don’t have to worry too much about penetration or terminal ballistics. Hell, I would think that underpenetration would be a good thing in those cases – if the bullet doesn’t have enough “oomph” to puncture the other side of the skull, it will end up bouncing around inside the skull & doing even more damage.

I remember reading in a “gun book” one time where the author claimed that .22 LR slugs were quiet killers. Sometimes, a person gets hit by a .22 slug in the torso and seems to shrug it off, then later they just collapse and die with no warning (well, other than that .22 hole in their carcass) because the previous gunshot wound nicked an artery that finally gave way spectacularly.

55. lauraw - February 25, 2010

skinbad, my buddy Frank’s crazy uncle Dwight has a story about putting a road-injured deer “out of its misery” that is so horrifying yet funny, I crack up just thinking about him telling it.

56. Pupster - February 25, 2010

I think there is a law or something that requires dudes named ‘Dwight’ to be crazy.

57. GrumpyUnk - February 25, 2010

“One shot between the eyes will drop them like 3rd period French class.” – Centered but about 1-2″ above. An X from ear to eye. Where they cross is the spot.

Never meant to say that a .22 won’t do the job. It’s shot placement that determines it. Ask Sam Giancana.

Generally speaking, most folks don’t do that to well when shooting themselves.

58. Gromulin - February 25, 2010

Ditto on the big game kilt by a .22 story here…Dad once popped off a few rounds out of a pistol to scare a black bear away from their hunting camp (this was in the 40’s or 50’s…before I was born) in the middle of the night. Woke up in the morning to find a big area flattened out about 100 yards from camp, with a dead bear in the middle of it. Shot through the heart. I still have one of the teeth.

59. Vmaximus - February 25, 2010

Not a .22 story,
but growing up the next door neighbor’s dad was a detective at the local PD. He carried a little .38 chiefs special. We went camping one time and he demonstrated his fast draw. I was only 12 but the dude drew and fired what sounded like 1 shot into a paper plate 10 yards away. When I saw the plate it had 3 holes about 1″ apart right in the center.

I was impressed.

60. Michael - February 25, 2010

Um, one time I killed a woodchuck in our garage with a .22 — damn thing was scared and just wouldn’t leave.

OK, that was not a great story.

61. Lipstick - February 25, 2010

I shot a woodchuck in Reno, just to see him die. . .

62. doc - February 25, 2010

How much wood could a woodchuck chuck, if Michael didn’t shoot its face off?

63. Lipstick - February 25, 2010

Sadly, we’ll never know.

*plays Taps*

64. Dave in Texas - February 25, 2010

My oldest firearm is a Remington single shot .22 squirrel rifle. Dad’s brother bought it for him in 1939.

I’ve likely shot that rifle than all my other guns combined.

65. Lipstick - February 25, 2010

In Dallas garage the rifle blows
Between the Beemers row on row
That mark my crib; and in the house
Batman checking blogging, still bravely centering, corrects
Scarce heard amid the death to come.

I am the Dead. Short days ago
I lived, ate a mouse, pooped in your corner, saw flashlight glow,
Whizzed on the Makita power tools and now I die
In Dallas carport.

66. Lipstick - February 25, 2010

Yep. I’m going to hell.

67. Retired Geezer - February 26, 2010

*Geezer stands back in amazement at Lipstick’s poem

68. Lipstick - February 26, 2010

Well I tried to keep it enough to the original to make it recognizable, but change it enough to lessen the chances of hell-going.

69. Lipstick - February 26, 2010

Thanks Geezer.

(Unless “amazement” is slang for “horror”.)

🙂

70. Michael - February 26, 2010

but change it enough to lessen the chances of hell-going.

Nope. You are going to hell for desecrating “In Flanders Fields.”

Unless, of course, you happen to be “connected” with Lutheran Millennium HQ™. But that is going to take some serious “connections.”

I’m sure you get my drift.

71. Lipstick - February 26, 2010

Meet my attorney, “Cathy”.

I’m pretty sure she likes me because she sent me a most excellent ferret calendar.

72. Dave in Texas - February 26, 2010

*claps, one tear streaming down my face

73. Michael - February 26, 2010

Cathy sent you a ferret calendar?

I did not know that. Ferret calendars are not in the budget.

74. Lipstick - February 26, 2010

*Clutches ferret calendar to chest*

Out of my cold dead hands, Batman!

75. Vmaximus - February 26, 2010

Dave,
My grandfather came here from England in 1916. He bought a Stevens model 70 visible loading carbine. It is a sweet shooting gun. My buddy and I were in a orange grove shooting at a orange. He emptied the mag of his Marlin model 60 at a orange about 50 yards away. Missed all shots.

I emptied the mag (or tube on both if you prefer) of my Winchester model 77. Missed all shots.

Took the “squirrel rifle” (as grandpa called it) (the Stevens) and hit it 1st shot.

I love 22 rifles and have 8 or 10 of them

76. Dave in Texas - February 26, 2010

cooooool


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